Please help – my kitten is acting like he’s drunk?

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  • 2 December, 2009 at 7:43 pm #512755
    gini
    Participant

    I just saw this thread now. I am so sorry to hear about Stumpie’s diagnosis. I don’t know much about lukemia and feline aids, but hopefully your vet and other TDK members can help out more. I just wanted to let you know that you and Stumpie are in my prayers and I really hope everything comes out okay. Big hugs

    2 December, 2009 at 7:59 pm #512756
    TheKnittingNinja
    Participant

    If the vet did kit tests then ask for confirmatory tests on the lukemia and aids. For humans we can’t call anything positive on kit tests. All pos have to be sent for confirmatory testing

    2 December, 2009 at 9:38 pm #512757
    jcat
    Participant

    Oh, Skyron, my thoughts are with you and Stumpie. Cats with feline Aids can still lead happy healthy lives. I don’t know very much about feline leukaemia. {{{Skyron and Stumpie}}}

    2 December, 2009 at 9:49 pm #512758
    Skyron
    Participant

    I’m sorry, but this is going to be a really long post. Please bear with me?

    I’ve calmed down a lot since my last post – had some time out to digest this. The reason why I freaked out is that I lost my soul-cat (Jack, my avatar) in June to leukemia. He was diagnosed on the Wednesday, and we put him to sleep on the Thursday because he was just too sick (organ failure etc).

    Stump’s scenario looks a bit different. We caught the toxo-thing really early, and he’s responding well to the treatment. Last night I was worried because he was so pale and lethargic, he definitely has a lot more energy today, but he’s still awfully pale. But he’s eating well, and drinking, up and running/playing – Jack couldn’t do any of those things when we got his diagnosis. So I do have some hope for the child. Very tentatively, I’m soo scared of getting my heart broken all over again. My vet didnt really give me any info when he gave me the diagnosis, he gave Stump’s medicine to me and said we should continue his treatment at home. Dont know if this is because he wants us to have time to say goodbye, or to minimize stressfull experiences on Stump. Point is, I now have a refrigerator full of meds to give the child. My issue now is, I have soooo many questions to ask, and I’m sure my vet is going to feel I’m wasting his time. Dont get me wrong, the man is a diagnostic guru with animals, and he loves animals, but he’s definitely not a people-person, he’s not going to get where I’m coming from on an emotional level. So I’m going to post my ideas/thoughts and questions, and hopefully some experienced TDK’ers can enlighten me?

    1) Stump has no immunity of his own, due to the FIV, but also because he was a bottle baby, so he never got colostrum. Would it be worth it to supplement his diet with either some commercially produced colostrum, or to try to source some from someone who has a goat that is currently producing colostrum? I’ve heard from a lot of people that goat’s milk is a better milk replacement than any commercial product can hope to be, we just dont have goats in the cities. If it would help, I would buy my own bloody goat at this point . . .

    2) There are a few herbal remedies available here in SA that claim to help support compromised immune responses (as you may know the human aids epidemic in SA is a catastrophe), called eco-immune, developed specifically for animals. Would this contribute to helping Stump? I’m not a big believer in herbal remedies, but if it will help, I’ll definitely give it a try.

    3) The vet said I should keep Stump on the royal canin recovery diet because it’s very high in fat, protein and calory values. Is this a good idea where kidney failure is a very real possibility?

    4) Should I keep Stump isolated from my other cats? They’ve all had their shots, but when Jack died I was shocked to find that the FeLV on the label of the vaccine isn’t actually the same FeLV that cats usually get (I was really P*SS*D off about that), any way, vet said there are specific vaccines for immunising agains FeLV, but I dont know if it’s the same for FIV? If all my other cats were to get that shot, could they be allowed to socialise with each other again? I’m keeping Stump isolated for now.

    5) The indoor-thing. All the tags I’ve read say to keep FIV+ kitties inside; Stump loves playing outside and climbing trees, we have an enclosed courtyard. If we cleaned it out with bleach and introduced a lot of potted plants and trees and things, could Stump play ‘outside’ that way? It is entirely possible to keep the other cats out of that area?

    6) Stump & Sky – they love each other dearly. Sky was always a cold and distant b*&%$, but when Stump came along she took him on as her own baby. He tried (unsuccessfully) to nurse from her, but she let him, and she grooms him all the time, for all intensive purposes they are a mommy-baby pair. Sky is freaking out completely because we wont let her in to see her baby. She’s been sitting in front of his door, crying and scratching at all night. Sky lived at an integrated shelter for two years before we adopted her. Integrated = no cages, all the cats were free to roam and come and go as they pleased. Sky was the one who introduced the snuffles super-strain into our household. Would she possibly have been exposed to, and developed her own immune response to, FIV?

    So many of the things I’ve read so far say a diagnosis of FIV doesnt necessarily mean a death sentence. I’m really hoping that if we can get Stump over the toxoplasmosis we will be able to manage his care correctly and give him some quality time. I just want to have the right info to put together a decent treatment/management plan. The vet said Stump tested + for FIV, and PROBABLY has FeLV – he’s still a bit young to be showing the right amount of antibodies. Is it too much to hope for that he might not have FeLV? I’ll definitely get some confirmatory blood tests done, I just dont want to stress Stump out any more right now . . .I’ve run out of things to say for now, but I’m sure I’ll have more tomorrow 🙁

    2 December, 2009 at 10:03 pm #512759
    jcat
    Participant

    Skyron, I wish I knew more so that I could help you with your queries. I don’t think your vet would think you’re wasting his time, these are all important questions. I’ve usually found that vets and doctors respond really well to a non-waffly, simple list of questions — you could either give him a written copy and ask him to respond when he’s got a moment or ask if you could ask him these 6 simple questions.

    Speaking personally, my understanding is that it is not easy for cats to catch FIV from each other unless they are fighting. There is some question that they might be able to catch it from each other if they are sharing the same food and water bowls for a long period but vets don’t know, and that sounds iffy to me. It, in my understanding, basically behaves the same way as the human virus in terms of catching it.

    You can get your other cats vaccinated now, I believe, but I think it’s very expensive.

    So the decision about letting Stumpie associate with your other cats is something you need to think about, with your vet. I, personally, would not keep them apart (FIV is not easy to catch) and I would be happy to let Stumpie play outside (like the human virus, I don’t think it could survive outside the cat’s body for any length of time).

    But then in NZ, we don’t usually check for FIV (since the test is expensive and, until recently, there was no vaccine and no treatment) in shelters. Thus there’s no actual way to know how widespread the virus is.

    From what Sox’s Mom has said, I think FeLV is a very different matter. I SO hope Stumpie doesn’t have it. Much love!

    2 December, 2009 at 10:08 pm #512760
    mayra
    Participant

    My parents had a cat with FIV. He lived happy and healthy for seven years until he disappeared one day (we believe he was poisoned by a neighbor who had done this to other neighborhood cats). But if it had not been for that, who knows how much longer he would have been around.

    In other words, with the proper care, Stump may be able to live a happy and long life. I’m sure there will be precautions your vet will want you to take regarding Stump and Sky, and it is part of his job to explain them to you.

    Best wishes for Stump.

    2 December, 2009 at 10:12 pm #512761
    Skyron
    Participant

    Any idea how I could get SM to see this thread and respond? Everyone seems to think she knows the most, so . . .??

    2 December, 2009 at 10:22 pm #512762
    jcat
    Participant

    Skyron, she’s in the breakfast cafe at the moment, just ask her, or start a thread for her (Calling Sox’s Mom).

    2 December, 2009 at 11:00 pm #512763
    SoxsMom
    Participant

    Okay FIV and FELV are not the same virus. Although FELV is horrid, it isn’t necessarily the end. I have a friend with an 18 year old FIV cat. My baby boy Sox was diagnosed and lived 1 hour longer. His blood was the color of rust water. I heaved when it was drawn, and I could not deal with him struggling to survive. It was a bad day. I had to say goodbye to him. Next I brought in my other two Teaser and Basil. Both had been vaccinated, so I felt relatively safe that they would be fine. I was devistated that Basil tested positive. I joined a feline leukemia site, which I will post with this at the end. I began to do all I could. For the next 22 months not a single sign or symptom. Then he got a kidney infection. I started treatment. He was in complete kidney failure in less than a week–probably due to the compromised immune system because of FELV. At the time I had a student of mine on the doorstep with kittens–the mother was run over and he just couldn’t handle all 4. I took 2 and was absolutely certain that Deuter and Nike would get the virus–I was very careful. I learned about mixing on the FELV site. It is doable. Please do not think this is the end. There is a group that will give you all the advice you will ever need. My only request is do not buy into the cobra venom crap–it is leathal ALWAYS.

    2 December, 2009 at 11:02 pm #512764
    SoxsMom
    Participant

    felvtalk@felineleukemia.org

    2 December, 2009 at 11:04 pm #512765
    SoxsMom
    Participant

    Get added on to the above link. Interferon is a good start. Also a boost of lysine is great, and you can get that at any pharmacy. I use that for Teaser as it helps with her kidneys and urinary tract.

    2 December, 2009 at 11:05 pm #512766
    Skyron
    Participant

    Thank you 🙂

    2 December, 2009 at 11:07 pm #512767
    Skyron
    Participant

    The vet started stump on interferon today, i’ll be doing a lot of other things like lysine as well (moducare, need to find out more about colostrum). Is it really necessary to keep stump away from the other cats?

    2 December, 2009 at 11:16 pm #512768
    SoxsMom
    Participant

    That is the toughest thing to answer. Teaser was vaccinated–then again so was Basil and that didn’t get him very far. I tried complete seperation at first. I had Basil locked in my master bedroom/bathroom. He and Teaser sat on each side of the door and cried pathetically! I tried and it didn’t work after 3 months. For the rest of Basil’s life he and Teaser were as usual inseperable. You have to know that this virus is highly contagious. Your other cats, vaccinated or not may contract the virus. On the organization list I sent you will soon see that it is at times hotly contested. Actually at this point I think most are either mixing those that have already been exposed and those with a FELV+ cat just make sure no more come into the home. I also couldn’t vaccinate Deuter and Nike at first either. They had to be 3 months. I had Basil at his worst then. Deuter is FELV-. If you mix, make sure that they do not groom, share a litterbox, share a food dish, or share a water dish. It is important that they do not share–very difficult to get cats to not share.

    2 December, 2009 at 11:16 pm #512769
    JerseyJoan
    Moderator

    Just saw this thread. My thoughts and prayers are with you. {{{Skyron & Stumpie}}}

    2 December, 2009 at 11:24 pm #512770
    SoxsMom
    Participant

    Skyron B12 injections help as well. It will really help with Stumpies’ energy level. First thing is to get a vet that is willing to treat. A lot of vets see FELV+ and then say put them down now. My vet was much the same way and I refused with Basil. He was not sick. My job then became how to keep him healthy. I swear if I had him on a different food–he only ate dry and occassional raw–he would be with me now.

    2 December, 2009 at 11:25 pm #512771
    GizzysAuntie
    Participant

    I don’t know about letting infected and non-infected cats with FELV mingle, but my Sam was FIV-positive when I got him and lived 14 years more. For 13 of those years, Lady Coco lived right with him, shared his food bowl and water dish (impossible to keep her away) and is still, at 14, FIV-negative. But she never let him groom her. This may not be the general rule; the situation may vary from cat to cat, especially with FELV in the mix.

    2 December, 2009 at 11:39 pm #512772
    SoxsMom
    Participant

    It is very contagious and vaccinations are not always effective!

    3 December, 2009 at 5:54 pm #512773
    Skyron
    Participant

    The thing is, my vet is treating me and Stump at the moment as if we should prepare ourselves for the worst. Stump is getting a bit better from the toxo every day, he shows fewer and fewer symptoms, he has energy, he’s eating really well, even his gums look a bit pinker today. I dont want to get my hopes up, but I dont want to keep treating him as if he’s gonna die any minute now?

    3 December, 2009 at 6:07 pm #512774
    SoxsMom
    Participant

    You have to remember that FELV+ cats have a death sentence. There is no cure. You have to decide how he lives the remainder of his life. Vets know the devistation of this disease. I say a cat can be struck down as easy as a human. Things happen, but that should preclude you from living. As Stumpie lives your vet should get a little better. It is always ideal to have a vet that supports you. Mine didn’t at all–I almost left him. Then decided to teach him. He now does not automatically tell anyone with a FELV+ cat to have it put down. He actually began to learn as I learned. The first thing that helps is getting him on lysine and B12 if you can get it. Then anytime he looks sick or sluggish get Interferon on board quickly! Live each day one at a time and enjoy him! If I had put Basil down when my vet said I would have missed 22 months of joy with him! If you can get Stump past the 2 year mark, you could get him to live to be 10-14 years old or more! The first 2 years are rough. He will need to be in a stress free environment–not always possible. Be very careful to limit stress and that will help him more than anything. Although he likes going outside, it is best to turn him into an indoor kitty or get him an an outdoor enclosure. I promise you will have the support you need here if your vet is leary–I sure did!

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